00:22 Hey, welcome back to the show. And today I'm so excited to have with us someone who's got a great reputation, has exited the company and is building something new, something fun, something fresh. Ville, will you tell us who you are and what problem do you like to solve with your business?

00:40 Yeah, I'm like you said, I'm Ville, Co-founder and CEO of Privv. And Privv is the only project management tool designed for higher education and K-12 schools. So basically what we're doing is we are building the future of education facilities by changing the way construction projects are managed to enrich the lives of students, teachers and staff.

01:09 Okay, so this is a construction project management for higher education, schools, all that kind of stuff. Is that the gist of it?

01:17 Yeah, and we are talking about very large scale complex projects typically in budgets over, you know, 100 million and so.

01:29 Those are big projects. Okay, so why this problem? Have you built schools? Have you built, what's your background in being involved in something like this? How did you know this was even a problem that needed to be solved?

01:43 Yeah, that's a great question. So I've actually been married to a teacher for over 20 years. And during that time, I've seen several construction projects in her schools, both in Finland and over here. And typically, they tend to be either delayed over budget, or even dangerous to the teachers and kids. So I saw that problem, you know, a long time ago. This summer when I met my co-founder Chris Nations, who is running an advisory company for university construction projects, he said to me, you know, I don't know a lot about software, but I know a lot about university construction projects. And I was like, yeah, I don't, I don't know a lot of construction at all, but I know everything about software. So that's how it got started this summer. And yeah, it's been a fun run.

02:39 I love it. I love it. I love it. Now this is, this is all happening this summer. Prior to the summer though, you've been involved in an exit and you had a company that, that you exited from. You've also, I mean, if you Google you, you're very visible. You've been on a TEDx, you've been on other podcasts. I mean, talk to us about like why so soon? I mean, you just barely got done with it. I guess a lot of people think, ah, once I reached that, that point, I wanna take a break for a while, and you drove right into a new project. Tell us about that transition.

03:12 Yeah, you know, Todd, I tell you, and my plan was to take a long set vertical at least the end of the year, but that didn't work. It got really boring real fast. And I did a lot, a lot of stuff, but I noticed, you know, on week two or three, I had registered maybe 20 different domains. And so it's, it's in you and no, it's, it's what I, what I like to do. But that question is really good. And it's something that I was also thinking about is, and I'm sure a lot of entrepreneurs are thinking about because like, there's that point of exit and you have all kinds of plans and things to do after that. But what you really love doing is, you know, starting new running this into this creating something that makes the work better place.

04:05 Right, and it really does. And I think that you may agree with me that once you've built, scaled, grown, exited one time, you kind of see the pattern and you can really jump into, say for example, constructing higher education buildings. I mean, you can kind of apply what you've learned to different places, would you agree with that?

04:30 I absolutely do. So, and especially today, you know, when I think about six years ago, when I started the previous company in the United States, we didn't have all the tools, AI tools we have today. So it's that combined with the experience. And I want to say your connection to your network and, and people, you know, who are going to help you, you know, it's, it's definitely faster, easier, stronger.

04:59 I totally, network is so important and also visibility to seeing that other people have done it is such a confidence builder. You know, a lot of people listening to the show are not in a multiple exit scenario like you are. They've either launched their business for the first time or they maybe had multiple launches, some unsuccessful, some successful. They're trying to figure out how to get past launch mode and in scale up mode, how do you view that transition? Because it's a real thing, isn't it? How do you see that transition between launch and into going into growth mode?

05:36 Well, my honest opinion is it's a different mindset and most often different people scaling businesses versus starting businesses.

05:49 Walk us through that because most people don't get that. They're like, no, this is my buddy, this is my friend who helped me launch the business. They're gonna be a part of it the whole time. Why does that not work out most of the time?

06:01 Um, we are, I think we are fueled by, by different things and, uh, different type of, you know, motivations and drivers and, and whatnot. And, uh, it's just a different, different game altogether. When you like myself, I'm doing a lot of, I'm wearing a lot of hats right now. So, um, I just love it, but some people don't. And I get it.

06:28 It's kind of a disaster sometimes when you're wearing too many hats. And how does that, like at what point do you start taking off the hats and handing them off?

06:39 Oh, yeah. So it's, yeah, I guess that's the hard part. Yeah, you already mentioned is like, this is my baby, I can't leave, or maybe the investor doesn't want you to leave and, and so on. But yeah, the smarter I get, the more mistakes I make, you know, I think it's gonna be just an honest upfront conversation sooner rather than later, you know, and, and put it on table. I do want to say to you mentioned, this is who have maybe failed or succeeded. I think there's plenty of time for both. So like serial entrepreneurs and parallel entrepreneurs, you know, we can do simultaneously a lot of stuff.

07:26 Agreed, agreed. And I think that brings up a good point. You exited, you were on your whole two-week sabbatical that you had, and you were buying ideas and domains, and all of a sudden a friend comes along and says, "'Hey, I got a problem here. "'I don't know how to solve it.'" And you're like, "'I know how to solve that.'" Like, what made you think that you could solve that? I mean, you have no experience in the industry. What happened in your head?

07:55 Well, yeah. Yeah. So what's really interesting in our case is that we are actually operating in three different industries. So we are not just a SaaS software company or a construction company, but we are also in education. So we have three different verticals we are looking at. And, uh, and you know, it's, it's not often when you have, when you are strong in all of them. So my strong tweet is obviously on software side of things and building companies, growing companies and everything that comes to it.

08:32 I love it, I love it. Now I see, personally, I've seen a lot of businesses go from zero to a million dollars is big. That's like a bid benchmark. You get to that million dollars a year, you're kind of operating where you've got at least some people helping you. You've got clients you think that are your niche. Then you kind of get to that three to five million mark and there's another benchmark where it's like, hey, hey we're.I've got people running different things. This is awesome. I took off some hats. Talk to us about the 10, 15, and even $20 million mark. What does that feel like to build? And what is the mindset shift you had to go through before you got that business to a point of exit?

09:18 Yeah, I think all businesses are going through periods of flow and periods of restructure and that growth mode. That's actually something I wrote down. I'm going to do different this time. I'm going to enjoy the journey, not test the outcome. And so, because it's typically we tend to run from an accomplishment or achievement to another always, you know, going after another nice trophy or win or whatnot. This time I'm going to enjoy it. So, uh, and whether it's at 10 million or 15 million or, or a hundred million, um, you know, uh, that's, that's my takeaway, hopefully from, from this journey and this run.

11:27 I love it. Now with Preev, as you've been talking about it, I have a lot of thoughts going through my head. Some of them are, A, you already know a lot of things that you're gonna be confronted with in terms of challenges and things like that you're likely gonna hit. But B, you mentioned already network. Will you talk us through what impact your network and associations with other CEOs, things like that have on your ability to just dive into an industry you've never been into and kind of adapt your journey.

12:02 Absolutely. Yeah. With, um, and I do want to say with Brave, um, we, cause we are operating complex projects, so we have to remember, uh, complex projects versus simple projects. So complex project, you make a good smart decision and you may still fail. And that's what's called bad luck. And you made a bad choice and you may still succeed and that's called luck. And we're, what we're trying to do is we are trying to remove the luck from Equation and Health universities to run projects professionally. But yeah, I actually have been privileged to join three different professional peer groups, CEO groups, two in California and one in Arizona and Scottsdale, where I'm still part of. And yeah, those, I mean, people in those groups, they've taught me almost everything I know. We have to remember I moved from a foreign country, 12 hours away and, you know, barely spoke the language, didn't know much about running a business over here. And, and, you know, so they've been a really strong support to me and personally really good friends nowadays.

13:24 I love it, I love it, I love it. So you're talking about three different peer groups and that, you know, how do they work? Because a lot of people don't know, that they've heard about them, they've heard the names, but they never really thought they fit. How did you feel like you fit? And how did that association kind of build you up?

13:46 Well, I didn't. So I mean, but my first Vistich chair was crazy enough to invite me into the group, even though I was the oddball, you know, with a very international background and so on. But the interesting thing with those groups is the more you bring in, the more you get and, and, and of course, you know, if, if one is thinking, you know, I'm going to go there, I'll sell or I'll do business. That's not going to work as you know. So it's more like getting to know those people and being real you. So you'll get the real people in return.

14:33 Right, right, no doubt about it, no doubt about it. And for those that aren't familiar with peer groups, I'm a huge advocate of these things. I honestly, I feel like no CEO should be without a peer group. I just feel like there are so many things to learn from your peers who are actively running businesses. One of the things, Ville, that I think that, and maybe you can echo this sentiment, is that it's one thing to have a coach or a consultant who was a has-been who maybe ran a business and they exited 20 years ago and they, they're very helpful in some regards, but they don't know the environment we're operating in today. I mean, who could have coached us through COVID? You know what I mean? Like who could have helped us really understand what we were dealing with there? And I think that, you know, what are your thoughts on that? I mean, how do you feel like the group who are actively operating their businesses were able to help you as opposed to a different resource for some of those things.

15:37 Yeah, that's, that's a great question. Cause I see them as my advisory group. So, and my advisory board or however you name it. And when you look at it that way, the cost is actually not that high. So if you went out and hired your own advisory group, you'd be paying quite a bit more than joining a peer group. But, uh, yeah, I intentionally park some of the questions or issues I may have. And on our monthly meeting, yeah, we'll go through and I'll get instead of advice from one mentor or two mentors, I'm getting 16 opinions. And that's priceless.

16:18 Yeah, yeah. I love it, I love it. Well, I'm so glad you brought that up and I'm not gonna dwell on it too much longer, but I will say to those of you listening, if you haven't considered already joining an advisory board or a peer network group, I highly recommend it and it will make a difference in your business and how you operate. With that being said, Ville, going back to Prive, you're in launch mode right now. You've just come through exit. I mean, honestly, in the same year to do exit and launch, that's not super common, because I think a lot of people do like to take that time away from just thinking about business for a minute, but you're not that guy. We get it, you're Superman. So as you've done this, and you're moving into this new operation, what are some of your biggest concerns? You kind of know where you might stub your toe a little bit here. What are you looking out for? And how are you trying to prevent some of these negative things from happening?

17:17 Yeah, that's a great question again. So, you know, we have to talk to our users, we have to do our beta really well. And we're using the tool for Florida State, Penn State and bigger major universities right now. So we need to listen well and improve because we may have an idea. Okay, this is how to solve the problem. But most likely, you know, we will pivot one or two or a few times, you know, to where at least we have to be able to customize the tool to based on the feedback we are getting. And so, you know, that's, that's sort of the biggest question I have, are we building the right thing? And are we building it right? So those two things, you know, in addition to, you know, the normal stop setting up workplace where people want to work and also making sure people are coming to us, which is marketing.

18:21 Okay, so I've got a question. I mean, you just, in that simple statement, you brought up so many questions in my mind. You're talking about a year one SaaS product, and you've already got three major universities using the tool. How in the world were you able to make that happen?

18:38 That's what I mean. You know, it's basically a blue ocean without a tool that matches the need. So, and so there's definitely there's need and demand for something like this, but you know, we can also look at project management tools and that marketplace is about $6 billion. So it's a huge red ocean. So, but that's why I talk about purple ocean being, you know, we combined the blue ocean and the red ocean with tools. So, but yeah, there's demand and, and yeah, super happy with those, those projects ongoing.

19:21 Good for you, man. That is super exciting. And with that type of revenue, I mean, I'm imagining, are you, I mean, are you cash flowing? Are you, I mean, you're certainly have some funds to invest, but are you able to get this thing boost strapped all the way to a certain level? Or what's your plan with that?

19:40 Yeah, we, so, okay, there's some revenue, but we're still talking about, we have alpha users, we have beta users, and we want to make sure we're building the right thing. So, not focusing on the revenue coming in as much. And yeah, we're well funded for, for a bit. And I'll be happy to share my papers, but they're long. And so, yeah, I did, did my planning pretty well. I think we have a solid plan for the future.

20:10 Awesome, I love it, I love it. And for those of you listening, one lesson that I would like our listeners to really gather from you, Ville, is how your mind works in terms of, okay, I am going to bootstrap to a certain degree, I'm going to get us to a certain level of completion, not necessarily to revenue generation, but to completion, to where your users feel really happy about the product, and then. Look for some funding. Are you looking strategic? Are there people you've already got in mind?

20:42 Yes, yes and no. So what I want to make sure we have like a very solid product market fit. And after that, yes, I'm thinking in my calculations, we're looking at end of next year, when we're starting to talk a couple of selected VCs for funding. But until that, most likely not.

21:08  Awesome, wow, I love it. I love hearing guys like you that can do that. I am also a relentless bootstrapper, and for those of you that are bootstrapping, hurrah to you, but please, have in your plan, have in your strategy something that Ville is doing right now. He's bootstrapping to a point at which point he knows he's gonna need to raise money to, really, to grow at the rate that's required by the demand you're hoping to generate. Is that right?

21:39 Yeah, I agree. And you want to build those relationships with the investors you want to work with throughout the year, you know, not just when you need it, but build up the relationships, you know, make sure you're under their radar. And they know what's going on. So it makes things a lot easier.

22:00 Love it, love it. That is some really golden nugget right there. That's some really good advice because I think people oftentimes, when they screw any one thing up, it's usually the financing. And it's usually, even when you bootstrap, you can screw up your financing to where you just don't have the cash flow to keep up with your demand. And I'm imagining that in your case, that might be the problem you run into is you won't have a problem even through word of mouth and some of your marketing, getting people to want to onboard, but do you have enough staff to onboard? Do you have enough project management? Do you have enough? All those things come into play, and it doesn't mean that you're stupid for wanting to raise money. It means that you want to operate at the level your company needs to.

22:49 Right. Yeah. And I do want to say, like I said before, there's a lot young companies can do with the modern tools we have today to run lean and operate your sales and marketing very efficiently. And still make good results. Yeah.

23:05 Yeah, agreed. Agreed, agreed. Awesome stuff. I love where this interview's gone, Ville. I love that, I love your experience level and I love the way you've been able to express yourself. You know, who'd have thought when you came across the, from 12 hours away to Scottsdale, you'd be able to speak as comfortably as you are about these things. I appreciate this very much. 

23:28  Me too.

23:29 So Ville, moving forward, I mean, you have gotten here, you've given some credit to your peer groups. We all tend to have a mentor, though, specifically, who kind of helps us get to where we're at today. And I would love to give a shout out to that person. So somebody like to recognize in the show today that has been there for you.

23:51 Just one?

23:53 Hey, you can do a few. I don't care. Give it out. 

23:56 Besides my wife.

23:57 Oh, besides your wife. Yes, that's an obvious one.

24:04 Okay. Okay, I'll pick three. So because I've had three amazing chairs in my peer group. So Michelle, she would in Orange County, Scott Reeves in the Bay Area, and Troy Rice here in Arizona. So cheers.

24:23 Love it. I love it. And thank you to you guys, honestly, for you Vistage Chairs, for doing what you do. I've been part of those groups before as well, and I will say that the work you do is changing lives and changing families, and I appreciate what you do and how you do it, so thank you. And for those of you looking for peer groups, I'm telling you right now, be looking, and I'll catch up with you later. I've got one in particular I'd love for you to look at, but be late. Thank you for your time. I really appreciate you being a part of the show and I wish you the best success with Privv. And honestly, I can't think of a university that isn't in a building mode at all times. And so this sounds like a great solution. It is a blue ocean in the territory that you're niching into, in this red ocean of lots of products. So very, very cool blend of your blue and red oceans. And if you don't know what we're talking about, just Google it.

25:20 Thanks, Todd. Appreciate it.